VS moving to EDI?

[Ekally1]

Think the simple way to put team GLA overall is leaderless ... needs strong leaders , go getters , think out the box ... said years ago about this management team , dont take pleasure saying i was right ...

[Iain]

What we don't know is whether Virgin gave the airport a heads up that this was in the cards, as part of a strategic move by Delta to focus all their activities in one place, and therefore the decision was out of Virgin's hands. The GLA service was highly successful over the years since starting in 2007, and generally growing, particularly with the involvement of Virgin Holidays, so presumably the holiday arm is on board with this. It will be interesting to see what level this develops to, given the capacity of the 747s.

Unfortunately I can't see any alternative provider that GLA could turn to in order to maintain an Orlando service, as Tui is very much an in-house charter operation now being geared to feeding its cruise ships.

If, as others have said, they were given a heads up and opportunity to counter offer and failed then it's awful and just suggests that they're financially dominated.

From the CAA stats, GLA-MCO+SFB direct in 2019 was about 91k and in 2018 was about 111k. This interview:

https://www.anna.aero/2019/04/03/glasgo ... -scotland/

quotes 50k indirects to MCO in 2018, so total market in 2018 about 160k, guessing maybe 130-140k in 2019. If we take away the 30-40k claimed by EDI route shop entry to be EDI catchment then about 100-110k. In comparison the EDI pax using GLA (about 40k) plus indirects (48k claimed) then EDI-MCO about 90k top end. So GLA is very likely the bigger market - and a market that deserves service.

I don't believe MCO (from either airport) is finite and not expandable. I've seen Visitscotland research that named FL as the number 1 state of origin for US visitors to Scotland. Unfortunately VS didn't seem very interested in promoting the GLA service - I've lost count of how many people from FL I've come across who weren't aware of the service. It will be very annoying if VS now start promoting EDI heavily in FL.

Wrt we had about 190k direct to the USA in 2019 and nearly 240k in 2018. Plus GLA claiming in 2018 55k indirects to NYC, 50k to MCO and 25k to BOS, which would suggest that total indirects to USA may were well over 100k and perhaps could be nearing 200k. Also tourism stats showed Glasgow with big rises in US visitors before covid, iirc 3rd most visited in UK. GLA-MCO and GLA-USA in general is a market that should be served and if GLA can't get any more/replacement service they're clearly not up to it imo.

Imo this is clearly an opportunity for EI, but its perhaps unlikely to be possible by next summer. EK are interesting, but I think there are a lot of issues in that one including logistics and seasonality - but it could certainly give VS something to think about!

That said, do GLA have people to pull off a deal with these airlines? Probably not.......

[PiperOne]

What we don't know is whether Virgin gave the airport a heads up that this was in the cards, as part of a strategic move by Delta to focus all their activities in one place, and therefore the decision was out of Virgin's hands. The GLA service was highly successful over the years since starting in 2007, and generally growing, particularly with the involvement of Virgin Holidays, so presumably the holiday arm is on board with this. It will be interesting to see what level this develops to, given the capacity of the 747s.

Unfortunately I can't see any alternative provider that GLA could turn to in order to maintain an Orlando service, as Tui is very much an in-house charter operation now being geared to feeding its cruise ships.

If, as others have said, they were given a heads up and opportunity to counter offer and failed then it's awful and just suggests that they're financially dominated.

From the CAA stats, GLA-MCO+SFB direct in 2019 was about 91k and in 2018 was about 111k. This interview:

https://www.anna.aero/2019/04/03/glasgo ... -scotland/

quotes 50k indirects to MCO in 2018, so total market in 2018 about 160k, guessing maybe 130-140k in 2019. If we take away the 30-40k claimed by EDI route shop entry to be EDI catchment then about 100-110k. In comparison the EDI pax using GLA (about 40k) plus indirects (48k claimed) then EDI-MCO about 90k top end. So GLA is very likely the bigger market - and a market that deserves service.

I don't believe MCO (from either airport) is finite and not expandable. I've seen Visitscotland research that named FL as the number 1 state of origin for US visitors to Scotland. Unfortunately VS didn't seem very interested in promoting the GLA service - I've lost count of how many people from FL I've come across who weren't aware of the service. It will be very annoying if VS now start promoting EDI heavily in FL.

Wrt we had about 190k direct to the USA in 2019 and nearly 240k in 2018. Plus GLA claiming in 2018 55k indirects to NYC, 50k to MCO and 25k to BOS, which would suggest that total indirects to USA may were well over 100k and perhaps could be nearing 200k. Also tourism stats showed Glasgow with big rises in US visitors before covid, iirc 3rd most visited in UK. GLA-MCO and GLA-USA in general is a market that should be served and if GLA can't get any more/replacement service they're clearly not up to it imo.

Imo this is clearly an opportunity for EI, but its perhaps unlikely to be possible by next summer. EK are interesting, but I think there are a lot of issues in that one including logistics and seasonality - but it could certainly give VS something to think about!

That said, do GLA have people to pull off a deal with these airlines? Probably not.......

There's also nothing in the market to replace Thomas Cook's capacity, I would have thought VS would have been eyeing it up, but only doing 2 a week suggests they see a big downturn in the Florida market, given that pre-pandemic in 2019 we had round 5 a week combined. Perhaps looking at selling on Delta as well to help fill their flights.

Either way, GLA has yet another mountain to climb.

[Sharpal7]

What we don't know is whether Virgin gave the airport a heads up that this was in the cards, as part of a strategic move by Delta to focus all their activities in one place, and therefore the decision was out of Virgin's hands. The GLA service was highly successful over the years since starting in 2007, and generally growing, particularly with the involvement of Virgin Holidays, so presumably the holiday arm is on board with this. It will be interesting to see what level this develops to, given the capacity of the 747s.

Unfortunately I can't see any alternative provider that GLA could turn to in order to maintain an Orlando service, as Tui is very much an in-house charter operation now being geared to feeding its cruise ships.

If, as others have said, they were given a heads up and opportunity to counter offer and failed then it's awful and just suggests that they're financially dominated.

From the CAA stats, GLA-MCO+SFB direct in 2019 was about 91k and in 2018 was about 111k. This interview:

https://www.anna.aero/2019/04/03/glasgo ... -scotland/

quotes 50k indirects to MCO in 2018, so total market in 2018 about 160k, guessing maybe 130-140k in 2019. If we take away the 30-40k claimed by EDI route shop entry to be EDI catchment then about 100-110k. In comparison the EDI pax using GLA (about 40k) plus indirects (48k claimed) then EDI-MCO about 90k top end. So GLA is very likely the bigger market - and a market that deserves service.

I don't believe MCO (from either airport) is finite and not expandable. I've seen Visitscotland research that named FL as the number 1 state of origin for US visitors to Scotland. Unfortunately VS didn't seem very interested in promoting the GLA service - I've lost count of how many people from FL I've come across who weren't aware of the service. It will be very annoying if VS now start promoting EDI heavily in FL.

Wrt we had about 190k direct to the USA in 2019 and nearly 240k in 2018. Plus GLA claiming in 2018 55k indirects to NYC, 50k to MCO and 25k to BOS, which would suggest that total indirects to USA may were well over 100k and perhaps could be nearing 200k. Also tourism stats showed Glasgow with big rises in US visitors before covid, iirc 3rd most visited in UK. GLA-MCO and GLA-USA in general is a market that should be served and if GLA can't get any more/replacement service they're clearly not up to it imo.

Imo this is clearly an opportunity for EI, but its perhaps unlikely to be possible by next summer. EK are interesting, but I think there are a lot of issues in that one including logistics and seasonality - but it could certainly give VS something to think about!

That said, do GLA have people to pull off a deal with these airlines? Probably not.......

There's also nothing in the market to replace Thomas Cook's capacity, I would have thought VS would have been eyeing it up, but only doing 2 a week suggests they see a big downturn in the Florida market, given that pre-pandemic in 2019 we had round 5 a week combined. Perhaps looking at selling on Delta as well to help fill their flights.

Either way, GLA has yet another mountain to climb.

This mountain has a very slippery slope and AGS has fallen in to the abyss already. Would like to be positive but this latest horrendous loss to GLA is the final straw. Yes, new management would possibly help but even they will have little chance of enticing the carriers established at EDI to pack up and move to GLA. I've voiced my fears before about UA and WS. I fancy UA will restart EWR services at EDI first....and as for GLA who knows.

[egpffqtv]

I think the best GLA can hope for now is that FI go 2 x daily and maybe deal in Aer Lingus UK and have them mop up most transatlantic stuff from GLA that isn’t going on BA via LHR. That’s if EDI doesn’t manage to lure FI away and deal in EI UK!!

[Ekally1]

I think the best GLA can hope for now is that FI go 2 x daily and maybe deal in Aer Lingus UK and have them mop up most transatlantic stuff from GLA that isn’t going on BA via LHR. That’s if EDI doesn’t manage to lure FI away and deal in EI UK!!

Agree with this ... our best option going forward

[bill]

I don’t think GLA’s management have put a foot right since Amanda left.

My only hope for positive change is that we retain what we have left and get a Ryanair base.

There’s no point in folks comparing GLA to EDI. That ship sailed about 20 years ago.

They haven't and we knew Provan's track record before AGS took over. No fan of lo-co and London-centric. What chance did we stand from the word go?
Can only hope AGS get bored and feck off to ruin some other airport(s) before all we're left with is direct flights to London.

[atuk]

I have stated before the critical mass of alliance carriers does have bearing where airlines choose to operate from and base aircraft.

I too, like most folks here, was not only dismayed about the VS move but can understand the DL/VS operation; more so as many EDI-JFK pax had VS code share tickets. Perhaps VS feel they can tap into an alternative gateway by using DL as a connecting flight to other destinations.

In my own view GLA’s demise started with the UA 15years celebrations at GLA. A lot of input and hard work was undertaken by AGS to ensure a successful day complete with Las Vegas showgirls, hamburgers and other foods plus a real party atmosphere at Gate 27. I was on shift that morning and still have a photo somewhere flanked by two showgirls. What happened soon afterwards? UA announce ORD.... from EDI! A real kick in the teeth and I remember saying this to management at the time. Then the GLA-EWR winter service was dropped. Once again I had the opportunity to question that with the UA U.K. manager at an SPAA evening in Aberdeen. He simply stated it was a tough decision and one not taken lightly however EDI had more fat during the summer season to carry it through the winter.

Without trying to add to the disappointment or rub salt in the aching wounds I personally have checked in loads of pax in EDI who originate from the West of Scotland. And not just leisure passengers too. One morning on the second service I had a large party travelling to BUD via AMS all from a company based in Inchinnan industrial estate. Another forum member posted about a cruise where the flights over AMS departed from EDI not GLA. So the travel trade themselves play a part in the capacity availability and split.

All I see is GLA back in the 1970s again. A handful of schedules to LHR, AMS, DUB,FRA,KEF plus the traditional charter destinations. And don’t count on TUI one based aircraft at GLA certainly won’t set the heather in fire.

[Ekally1]

Theres more than 1 based tui ... we have 2 738's and a 788 next year

[bill]

I think the best GLA can hope for now is that FI go 2 x daily and maybe deal in Aer Lingus UK and have them mop up most transatlantic stuff from GLA that isn’t going on BA via LHR.

That’s if EDI doesn’t manage to lure FI away and deal in EI UK!!

Yup. Wouldn't be at all surprised at this. There's is (and has never been) anything to instill confidence in GLA's current management.